Open-canoeing along ocean shoreline?

Al D wrote:
> Hi folks, can anyone recommend a book or point me to any good websites
> covering the use of open canoes in inshore waters? So far my canoeing
> has been limited to calm lakes and large inlets, but I'm contemplating
> venturing along the coastal shoreline. Obviously, an open canoe is not
> the safest craft for this, but I suspect people do it.
>
> I'm also interested in finding any reading material on the old
> American Indian canoeing techniques, attitudes, etc.
>
> TIA for any help,
>
> Al D

Lots of websites on polynesian canoes, and I also remember seeing one
up in Washington State, with lots of pictures of the canoe going
through the surf. All of these had and outrigger setup. I am sure that
lots of flotation would be recommended! They also used a sail to get
the power to get through surfzone. There was a lot of specialized
training involved in this form of canoeing!

When you say "costal shorelines" are you meaning surf zone? Surfing
play boating, or fishing/touring beyond the surf?

Also check out the recent account of two experienced kayakers who got
trashed and trapped in a surf zone for 2.5 hours, before being rescued.
This was a life threating situation, and probably not recommended for a
newbie for sure. They had alot of other equipment other than their
boats that allowed them to survive.

Lots of luck and have fun. Don't let us be hearing about some canoe
accident in the surf! HYY
 >> Stay informed about: Open-canoeing along ocean shoreline? 

Al D wrote:
> Hi folks, can anyone recommend a book or point me to any good websites
> covering the use of open canoes in inshore waters? So far my canoeing
> has been limited to calm lakes and large inlets, but I'm contemplating
> venturing along the coastal shoreline. Obviously, an open canoe is not
> the safest craft for this, but I suspect people do it.

In seven seasons of paddling the New England coast, I've only
encountered one canoe on the water and it was decked design with a
relatively small cockpit area. Although it's certainly possible to canoe
the quieter waters, a kayak is much better suited to paddling open
shores. If your going to do it in a canoe, you might want to consider
outfitting it with float bags similar to what whitewater canoeists use.
 >> Stay informed about: Open-canoeing along ocean shoreline? 

On 19 Jun 2006 15:27:54 -0700, "Hanta-Yo-Yo"
wrote:

>When you say "costal shorelines" are you meaning surf zone? Surfing
>play boating, or fishing/touring beyond the surf?

Hi, No - what I meant was touring along the coast, just seaward of the
surf zone.

>Also check out the recent account of two experienced kayakers who got
>trashed and trapped in a surf zone for 2.5 hours, before being rescued.
>This was a life threating situation, and probably not recommended for a
>newbie for sure. They had alot of other equipment other than their
>boats that allowed them to survive.
>
>Lots of luck and have fun. Don't let us be hearing about some canoe
>accident in the surf! HYY

Thanks for the input. As I am a relative beginner, I would only go out
on calm days (during the summer) and if the sea gets rough, I would
beach the canoe and make camp until calmer weather returns.

Yes, I have flotation bags inside the canoe... (actually, an
inflatable dinghy that I have wedged under the front seat and lashed
in place so it can't come out. I'm looking for other inflatable bags
or containers to pack into the extreme bow and stern.

I have encountered some 4ft high waves coming from the wake of
powerboats. The canoe sems to handle that size of wave OK (just), so
that's about the max I would like to have to cope with. (It's a
flat-bottomed canoe, BTW.) Out on the sea, the wind has to get up a
fair bit to produce that size of wave, so you can usually anticipate
that level of roughness well in advance, giving you enough time to
make it to the shore.

Al D
 >> Stay informed about: Open-canoeing along ocean shoreline? 

On Mon, 19 Jun 2006 22:00:19 GMT, Brian Nystrom
wrote:

>If your going to do it in a canoe, you might want to consider
>outfitting it with float bags

Yes, thanks; I've already got some flotation bags in place. Looking to
add to them though. Every inch of the canoe that's not in use, I'd
like to be filled with flotation bags.

Al D
 >> Stay informed about: Open-canoeing along ocean shoreline? 

On Mon, 19 Jun 2006 11:29:43 -0700, "frank"
wrote:

>"the complete book on sea kayaking", by derek hutchinson.

Thanks. I've got other books on Sea Kayaking, but not that one (yet).

Al D
 >> Stay informed about: Open-canoeing along ocean shoreline? 

On Tue, 20 Jun 2006 10:08:22 +0100, Al D wrote:

>Thanks. I've got other books on Sea Kayaking, but not that one (yet).

Correction: I have read that book! It provided some good tips.

Al D
 >> Stay informed about: Open-canoeing along ocean shoreline? 

Al D wrote:
> On 19 Jun 2006 15:27:54 -0700, wrote:
>
> >When you say "costal shorelines" are you meaning surf zone? Surfing
> >play boating, or fishing/touring beyond the surf?
>
> Hi, No - what I meant was touring along the coast, just seaward of the
> surf zone.

Which of course means you will need to go through the surf zone at
least twice every trip. Remember that the surf conditions when/where
you need to come in may be different from what it was where you went
out.

I've played in small surf with a WW canoe, and it's fun, but i wouldn't
want to try to go very far in bumpy water in that boat.

Steve
 >> Stay informed about: Open-canoeing along ocean shoreline? 

In article ,
Brian Nystrom wrote:
>Al D wrote:
>> Hi folks, can anyone recommend a book or point me to any good websites
>> covering the use of open canoes in inshore waters? So far my canoeing
>> has been limited to calm lakes and large inlets, but I'm contemplating
>> venturing along the coastal shoreline. Obviously, an open canoe is not
>> the safest craft for this, but I suspect people do it.
>
>In seven seasons of paddling the New England coast, I've only
>encountered one canoe on the water and it was decked design with a
>relatively small cockpit area. Although it's certainly possible to canoe
>the quieter waters, a kayak is much better suited to paddling open
>shores. If your going to do it in a canoe, you might want to consider
>outfitting it with float bags similar to what whitewater canoeists use.

I once visited the campground on Isle au Haut and there was a couple there who
had come over from the mainland in an open canoe. I asked them about it and
they said the weather had been calm and in fact, Isle au Haut is reachable by
hopping between smaller islands with every channel less than a mile in width,
and it's somewhat sheltered the whole way. That still sounds dangerous to me.

Apparently it's been proved that Indians occasionally crossed the Bay of
Fundy in canoes, and that involves being out of sight of land briefly. But
the article where I read that said, "Why did they do it? Testosterone,
undoubtedly!" I can imagine it--paddle across, trade a few bits and pieces
with the people on the other side to prove you'd done it, paddle back--and
then brag!
 >> Stay informed about: Open-canoeing along ocean shoreline? 

padeen wrote:
> Hmm.... flat-bottomed canoe, eh? That screams "RED FLAG RED FLAG" to me.
> If you in fact have a flat-bottomed canoe it is probably the most
> un-seaworthy craft imaginable; some initial stability, but flips when
> conditions get a bit rough. A flat-bottomed canoe won't ride the waves;
> they'll crash over it, and it can't be braced w/o flipping over.
>
> My advice to you would be to get this boat out as much as you can in very
> sheltered areas. Get hours and hours paddling it, and before long you'll
> know its characteristics, and will be able to understand the difference when
> you then try (and buy) a seaworthy craft.
>
> Brad Snow
> s/v Aldonza

This canoe begins to sound more like a jon-boat! Good for flat water
paddling, but when the water gets vertical in the surfzone, all you
need is some detergent to add to the Maytag, and you will have a full
blown laundromat! TnT OvO HYY
 >> Stay informed about: Open-canoeing along ocean shoreline? 

On 20-Jun-2006, jpurbric RemoveThis @nyx.nyx.net (John Purbrick) wrote:

> Apparently it's been proved that Indians occasionally crossed the Bay of
> Fundy in canoes

What size canoe? There's a difference between a two person and a 12 person
when it comes to crossing open water.

Mike
 >> Stay informed about: Open-canoeing along ocean shoreline? 

Hmm.... flat-bottomed canoe, eh? That screams "RED FLAG RED FLAG" to me.
If you in fact have a flat-bottomed canoe it is probably the most
un-seaworthy craft imaginable; some initial stability, but flips when
conditions get a bit rough. A flat-bottomed canoe won't ride the waves;
they'll crash over it, and it can't be braced w/o flipping over.

My advice to you would be to get this boat out as much as you can in very
sheltered areas. Get hours and hours paddling it, and before long you'll
know its characteristics, and will be able to understand the difference when
you then try (and buy) a seaworthy craft.

Brad Snow
s/v Aldonza
 >> Stay informed about: Open-canoeing along ocean shoreline? 

On 20 Jun 2006 18:00:24 -0700, in rec.boats.paddle "Tinkerntom"
wrote:

>This canoe begins to sound more like a jon-boat! Good for flat water
>paddling, but when the water gets vertical in the surfzone, all you
>need is some detergent to add to the Maytag, and you will have a full
>blown laundromat!

A true dory has a flat bottom; they handle reasonably well.

Jones
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!Jones wrote:
> On 20 Jun 2006 18:00:24 -0700, in rec.boats.paddle "Tinkerntom"
> wrote:
>
> >This canoe begins to sound more like a jon-boat! Good for flat water
> >paddling, but when the water gets vertical in the surfzone, all you
> >need is some detergent to add to the Maytag, and you will have a full
> >blown laundromat!
>
> A true dory has a flat bottom; they handle reasonably well.
>
> Jones

I have a hunch they work reasonably well as long as you keep them
headed directly into or out of the surf line! Get them turned sideways,
and get ready to go over. A dory is flat side to side, but highly
rockered from end to end. So they solve the problem of vertical water
as long as you keep them perpendicular to the surf. Also with the long
sweep oars, they have a lot of bracing capability and directional
control, compared to a paddle!

TnT OvO HYY
 >> Stay informed about: Open-canoeing along ocean shoreline?