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Next: Antenna wire for SSB
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External
Since: Apr 04, 2006
Posts: 138
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(Msg. 16) Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 8:39 am
Post subject: Re: Inverters DC to AC Battery help! [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: rec>boats>electronics (more info?)
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John Weston wrote:
> surfnturf, in article <kcxYf.218601$sa3.159619@pd7tw1no>,
> says...
>> Good points John.
>>
>> Typical rated power to the AC adapter for a laptop is close to 150W,
>> but output to computer is in order of 65W. Explains why the damn
>> things get hot.
>>
>> Direct power may well be worth investigation, rather than using DC
>> to AC to DC.
>>
>
> A good power supply design shouldn't just dump the excess
> power as heat. That's what linear regulators do, not the more
> usual switching regulators. However, even they loose
> something as heat so, in my opinion, just the one converter,
> to provide the laptop's DC input needs directly is best
>
> I use a DC-DC converter (12Vdc battery to approx 18Vdc) to
> power my laptop since there is only one conversion loss
> (+heat). It seems more efficient to me. Others prefer going
> all the way up to 120/240Vac (+heat) to power the laptop AC-DC
> power brick (+more heat) which goes back down to the 18-24Vdc
> needed by the laptop.
>
> I'm looking at replacing this with a 12V battery driven mini-
> ITX when I get a round tuit now my laptop is faulty... I'll be
> sailing on a boat with a shuttle-based system this summer so
> will see how well it works
The laptop's power brick plus an inverter is far better at dealing with the
voltage "spikes" that an alternator can put out, as I found to my cost a
couple of years ago, blowing the system board using one of these DC-DC
converters. |
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External
Since: Sep 23, 2006
Posts: 13
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(Msg. 17) Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 8:39 am
Post subject: Re: Inverters DC to AC Battery help! [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Look at
:http://www.logicsupply.com/product_info.php/cPath/40_63/products_id/504
The new dc-dc convertor handle things a lot better now.
Hanz
Dennis Pogson wrote:
> John Weston wrote:
>
>>surfnturf, in article <kcxYf.218601$sa3.159619@pd7tw1no>,
>>says...
>>
>>>Good points John.
>>>
>>>Typical rated power to the AC adapter for a laptop is close to 150W,
>>>but output to computer is in order of 65W. Explains why the damn
>>>things get hot.
>>>
>>>Direct power may well be worth investigation, rather than using DC
>>>to AC to DC.
>>>
>>
>>A good power supply design shouldn't just dump the excess
>>power as heat. That's what linear regulators do, not the more
>>usual switching regulators. However, even they loose
>>something as heat so, in my opinion, just the one converter,
>>to provide the laptop's DC input needs directly is best
>>
>>I use a DC-DC converter (12Vdc battery to approx 18Vdc) to
>>power my laptop since there is only one conversion loss
>>(+heat). It seems more efficient to me. Others prefer going
>>all the way up to 120/240Vac (+heat) to power the laptop AC-DC
>>power brick (+more heat) which goes back down to the 18-24Vdc
>>needed by the laptop.
>>
>>I'm looking at replacing this with a 12V battery driven mini-
>>ITX when I get a round tuit now my laptop is faulty... I'll be
>>sailing on a boat with a shuttle-based system this summer so
>>will see how well it works
>
>
> The laptop's power brick plus an inverter is far better at dealing with the
> voltage "spikes" that an alternator can put out, as I found to my cost a
> couple of years ago, blowing the system board using one of these DC-DC
> converters.
>
> |
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External
Since: Feb 28, 2006
Posts: 7
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(Msg. 18) Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 11:29 am
Post subject: Re: Inverters DC to AC Battery help! [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Imported from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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External
Since: Apr 04, 2006
Posts: 138
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(Msg. 19) Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 3:53 pm
Post subject: Re: Inverters DC to AC Battery help! [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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John Weston wrote:
> Dennis Pogson, in article <HmLYf.12303$NN4.1853@newsfe7-
> win.ntli.net>, says...
>
>>
>> The laptop's power brick plus an inverter is far better at dealing
>> with the voltage "spikes" that an alternator can put out, as I found
>> to my cost a couple of years ago, blowing the system board using one
>> of these DC-DC converters.
>>
> Interesting observation, Dennis. I haven't had this
> experience in either boat or car so I'll have to "look into
> it". It suggests bad design because why didn't a similar
> spike kill or ride-through the Inverter? The "buck
> converter" design should have a similar transformer isolating
> input and output as that in the inverter - unless it is a
> cheap transformerless design... Perhaps the solution is to
> get rid of the spike before it enters the electronics with an
> additional filter before the input?? At least that would be
> less power wasting.
There are probably cheap DC-DC converters which can't handle spikes, and
more expensive ones that can. The ones sold here in the UK for around £12
look altogether too simple to me. The one referenced by Hanz looks a
different matter altogether. I don't think the one bad experience I had is
sufficient to condemn all such devices, but a new system board these days is
as expensive as a new laptop, so my caution is understandable.
Running the laptop without the engine/alternator would probably be the
safest bet, but we all know crew members who will, as soon as the speed
drops below 2 knots, press the starter button!
Dennis. >> Stay informed about: Inverters DC to AC Battery help! |
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External
Since: Feb 28, 2006
Posts: 7
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(Msg. 20) Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:45 pm
Post subject: Re: Inverters DC to AC Battery help! [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Imported from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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External
Since: Sep 23, 2006
Posts: 13
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(Msg. 21) Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 6:28 pm
Post subject: Re: Inverters DC to AC Battery help! [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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I've been running VIA system (CL10000,SP13000) for serval years. I've
been going with M1-ATX ,PW-200v,PW80 and now the M2-ATX. I use the power
to run the mainboard and also my LCD monitor and my LCD/TV. The monitor
and tv like only 12v. I power supply provide 12 with 10-24v input.
I'm now looking at Commell LV-675D Pentium M Mini-ITX. The Intel cpu
will be about 2.0 G.(Intel Pentium M760 2.0GHz Processor - 533MHz 2MB
Cache). I use only standard HD and DVD-r/w, not NOTEBOOK drive.
Hanz
John Weston wrote:
> Dennis Pogson, in article <WJRYf.6695$8o.1068@newsfe6-
> win.ntli.net>, says...
>
>
>>There are probably cheap DC-DC converters which can't handle spikes, and
>>more expensive ones that can. The ones sold here in the UK for around £12
>>look altogether too simple to me. The one referenced by Hanz looks a
>>different matter altogether. I don't think the one bad experience I had is
>>sufficient to condemn all such devices, but a new system board these days is
>>as expensive as a new laptop, so my caution is understandable.
>>
>>Running the laptop without the engine/alternator would probably be the
>>safest bet, but we all know crew members who will, as soon as the speed
>>drops below 2 knots, press the starter button!
>
>
> Hanz's one is the one I have on my mini-ITX experimental rig:
>
> http://mini-itx.com/store/?c=10#p1830
>
> It's a full power supply for a mini-ITX motherboard, rather
> than a simple DC-DC converter for a laptop.
>
> It handles the drop down to 6V whilst the starter runs (but
> the house battery doesn't see this - now...). It also handles
> up to 28V, clamping any excess. It shuts down everything after
> a preset delay so you aren't left with the few milliamps of
> drain with a standard inverter or converter.
>
> Your comment about laptop repair is why I'm looking at the ITX
> route to use more standardized components. >> Stay informed about: Inverters DC to AC Battery help! |
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External
Since: Jan 25, 2006
Posts: 202
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(Msg. 22) Posted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 8:13 am
Post subject: Re: Inverters DC to AC Battery help! [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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> Typical rated power to the AC adapter for a laptop is close to 150W, but
> output to computer is in order of 65W. Explains why the damn things get
hot.
So don't bother with DC from the batteries to AC and then back again. Get a
laptop power supply that has a 12V input. The iJuice (aka iGo) adapters
work well. Then it's just a matter of using a cigarette lighter outlet. >> Stay informed about: Inverters DC to AC Battery help! |
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External
Since: Apr 04, 2006
Posts: 138
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(Msg. 23) Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 7:57 am
Post subject: Re: Inverters DC to AC Battery help! [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Bill Kearney wrote:
>> Typical rated power to the AC adapter for a laptop is close to 150W,
>> but output to computer is in order of 65W. Explains why the damn
>> things get hot.
>
> So don't bother with DC from the batteries to AC and then back again.
> Get a laptop power supply that has a 12V input. The iJuice (aka iGo)
> adapters work well. Then it's just a matter of using a cigarette
> lighter outlet.
All these little adapters work well on a regulated voltage, but with an
alternator running, the voltage can be far from regulated. >> Stay informed about: Inverters DC to AC Battery help! |
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