Good Morning Harry Krause

Eisboch wrote:
> "hk" <payer33859 RemoveThis @mypacks.net> wrote in message
> news:ZN6dnXDZP-_NITDVnZ2dnUVZ_q_inZ2d@comcast.com...
>>
>> The company would have been wiped out if a few guys left for better wages?
>>
>>>> snerk<<
>
> The "few" guys would represent half of the welding/fabrication shop. We
> only had about 45 employees total at the time and that included management,
> administrative, engineering, design, electrical, controls and machinists.
>
> Eisboch
>
>


Well, that's a management problem, right?

I mean, if American corporations are free to dive to the bottom in terms
of layoffs, pay reductions, and benefit cuts, employees should be free
to jump with their feet.
 >> Stay informed about: Good Morning Harry Krause 

"hk" <payer33859.DeleteThis@mypacks.net> wrote in message
news:l4KdnT0XZLdWSDDVnZ2dnUVZ_jCdnZ2d@comcast.com...
> Eisboch wrote:
>> "hk" <payer33859.DeleteThis@mypacks.net> wrote in message
>> news:ZN6dnXDZP-_NITDVnZ2dnUVZ_q_inZ2d@comcast.com...
>>>
>>> The company would have been wiped out if a few guys left for better
>>> wages?
>>>
>>>>> snerk<<
>>
>> The "few" guys would represent half of the welding/fabrication shop. We
>> only had about 45 employees total at the time and that included
>> management, administrative, engineering, design, electrical, controls and
>> machinists.
>>
>> Eisboch
>
>
> Well, that's a management problem, right?
>
> I mean, if American corporations are free to dive to the bottom in terms
> of layoffs, pay reductions, and benefit cuts, employees should be free to
> jump with their feet.


Good grief. Our guys booted them out the door. Don't you get it?
 >> Stay informed about: Good Morning Harry Krause 

Eisboch wrote:
> "hk" <payer33859.RemoveThis@mypacks.net> wrote in message
> news:l4KdnT0XZLdWSDDVnZ2dnUVZ_jCdnZ2d@comcast.com...
>> Eisboch wrote:
>>> "hk" <payer33859.RemoveThis@mypacks.net> wrote in message
>>> news:ZN6dnXDZP-_NITDVnZ2dnUVZ_q_inZ2d@comcast.com...
>>>> The company would have been wiped out if a few guys left for better
>>>> wages?
>>>>
>>>>>> snerk<<
>>> The "few" guys would represent half of the welding/fabrication shop. We
>>> only had about 45 employees total at the time and that included
>>> management, administrative, engineering, design, electrical, controls and
>>> machinists.
>>>
>>> Eisboch
>>
>> Well, that's a management problem, right?
>>
>> I mean, if American corporations are free to dive to the bottom in terms
>> of layoffs, pay reductions, and benefit cuts, employees should be free to
>> jump with their feet.
>
>
> Good grief. Our guys booted them out the door. Don't you get it?
>
>
>


It's not unusual for workers who are afraid of management to behave that
way, eh?

I'm not saying that was the case at your place, but it isn't unusual.
 >> Stay informed about: Good Morning Harry Krause 

"hk" <payer33859 DeleteThis @mypacks.net> wrote in message
news:l4KdnTkXZLfSSjDVnZ2dnUVZ_jCdnZ2d@comcast.com...

>
>
> It's not unusual for workers who are afraid of management to behave that
> way, eh?
>


Heard that line many times before. You aren't even original.

Eisboch
 >> Stay informed about: Good Morning Harry Krause 

"Eisboch" <rce.DeleteThis@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:o9-dnY2ZHO2nxjDVnZ2dnUVZ_rjinZ2d@giganews.com...
>
> <thunder.DeleteThis@TAKEOUTgti.net> wrote in message
> news:hJadnfMUoulgxDDVnZ2dnUVZ_vzinZ2d@posted.gtinet...
>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 16:00:31 -0400, Eisboch wrote:
>>
>>
>>> But, I read. I agree, years ago it was easy and "safe" to hire
>>> illegals. Laws with substantial penalties have been put in place to
>>> discourage that practice however and they are enforced.
>>>
>>> Eisboch
>>
>> Perhaps in your business, but in many sectors, construction for instance,
>> there is a large "underground" economy. Not only are illegals hired, but
>> many citizens are paid under the table. Estimates of illegal immigrants
>> are 10-15 million. They are coming here to make a living. Somebody is
>> hiring them.
>
>
> I realize that and have witnessed it. But, they are not typically
> "corporations". They are often small time construction or landscaper type
> businesses that simply don't show up on the radar screen.
>
> Eisboch
>

Corporations do hire them. They look at the required documentation and hire
them. The government may come back a year later and say the SS number is
bogus, but there is no way to run legal quick check on an employee's
documentation.
 >> Stay informed about: Good Morning Harry Krause 

hk wrote:

>
> I doubt it. I frequently go out on organizing calls with union reps, and
> the companies and employees we visit are not members of unions.
>
I hate labor unions. Always have.

Twenty-two years ago my father worked nights in a clutch factory, having
worked his way up over the years from machinist to foreman. The original
owner sold to a larger corporation, and after a while it became time to
negotiate a new contract. The factory had been breaking even or even
losing money on heavy-duty clutches, and the company wanted to start
making light-duty ones where there was more demand. They even went so
far as to move in equipment to start making them.

Even with the new product line, the company would still lose money if
they couldn't cut costs. During the negotiations they said they needed
the workers to take a small pay cut. The union, of course, wouldn't
stand for it. Eventually, the company gave them a take-it-or-leave-it
choice: Take a pay cut or we'll close the plant - and they offered a
severance package if the plant closed. Well, with severance dollar signs
in their eyes, they voted to close the plant. My father, who couldn't
even vote on it because he was a foreman, found himself out of a job at
age 60.

Just try to find a job at 60. It ain't easy to find a job at any age,
much less when you're so near retirement. He lived on unemployment
insurance for a year, then another year on the severance package, and
started collecting Social Security at 62, three years before he planned
to. The depression might have killed him had we not been around to help
him through it. He was never the same again.

The labor union members that decided to throw away their jobs did that
to him. I hate labor unions. Always will.

TJ
 >> Stay informed about: Good Morning Harry Krause 

"Calif Bill" <bmckeespam.DeleteThis@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:S66dnexfQf60wjPVnZ2dnUVZ_trinZ2d@earthlink.com...
>
> "Eisboch" <rce.DeleteThis@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> news:o9-dnY2ZHO2nxjDVnZ2dnUVZ_rjinZ2d@giganews.com...
>>
>> <thunder.DeleteThis@TAKEOUTgti.net> wrote in message
>> news:hJadnfMUoulgxDDVnZ2dnUVZ_vzinZ2d@posted.gtinet...
>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 16:00:31 -0400, Eisboch wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> But, I read. I agree, years ago it was easy and "safe" to hire
>>>> illegals. Laws with substantial penalties have been put in place to
>>>> discourage that practice however and they are enforced.
>>>>
>>>> Eisboch
>>>
>>> Perhaps in your business, but in many sectors, construction for
>>> instance,
>>> there is a large "underground" economy. Not only are illegals hired,
>>> but
>>> many citizens are paid under the table. Estimates of illegal immigrants
>>> are 10-15 million. They are coming here to make a living. Somebody is
>>> hiring them.
>>
>>
>> I realize that and have witnessed it. But, they are not typically
>> "corporations". They are often small time construction or landscaper
>> type businesses that simply don't show up on the radar screen.
>>
>> Eisboch
>>
>
> Corporations do hire them. They look at the required documentation and
> hire them. The government may come back a year later and say the SS
> number is bogus, but there is no way to run legal quick check on an
> employee's documentation.
>

I think the Duck correctly pointed out the error of my initial statement
whereby I left out the word "knowingly".

Eisboch
 >> Stay informed about: Good Morning Harry Krause 

"Eisboch" <rce.DeleteThis@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:0eadnYbTILYFSzDVnZ2dnUVZ_i2dnZ2d@giganews.com...
>
> "hk" <payer33859.DeleteThis@mypacks.net> wrote in message
> news:l4KdnT0XZLdWSDDVnZ2dnUVZ_jCdnZ2d@comcast.com...
>> Eisboch wrote:
>>> "hk" <payer33859.DeleteThis@mypacks.net> wrote in message
>>> news:ZN6dnXDZP-_NITDVnZ2dnUVZ_q_inZ2d@comcast.com...
>>>>
>>>> The company would have been wiped out if a few guys left for better
>>>> wages?
>>>>
>>>>>> snerk<<
>>>
>>> The "few" guys would represent half of the welding/fabrication shop.
>>> We only had about 45 employees total at the time and that included
>>> management, administrative, engineering, design, electrical, controls
>>> and machinists.
>>>
>>> Eisboch
>>
>>
>> Well, that's a management problem, right?
>>
>> I mean, if American corporations are free to dive to the bottom in terms
>> of layoffs, pay reductions, and benefit cuts, employees should be free to
>> jump with their feet.
>
>
> Good grief. Our guys booted them out the door. Don't you get it?
>
>
>
He will never get it. He's been brainwashed. Can't you tell? Talk to any
union lemming and you will hear the EXACT SAME sound bytes.
 >> Stay informed about: Good Morning Harry Krause 

On Aug 22, 12:45 pm, John H. <salmonremovebait@gmaildotcom> wrote:
> On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 09:10:50 -0700 (PDT), justwaitafrekinmin... DeleteThis @gmail.com
> wrote:
>
> >On Aug 22, 11:28 am, hk <payer33... DeleteThis @mypacks.net> wrote:
> >> justwaitafrekinmin... DeleteThis @gmail.com wrote:
>
> snipped
>
>
>
> >> > This kind of outright lie is why only you and Dick can talk about this
> >> > stuff. To the rest of us, the conversation is useless ..
>
> >> What outright lie? I recall you stating the police had tossed you down
> >> the stairs. I don't recall what problems you had with your "union shop,"
> >> nor do I care. Everyone has had "problems" sometime in life. Most of us
> >> get over them and move on.- Hide quoted text -
>
> >> - Show quoted text -
>
> >Nope, they shoved, I caught myself.. This is why nobody else can get
> >into your conversations, you can't be honest about anything..
>
> Why try?

Because I represent my business here and when he makes up deliberate
lies, distortions, and insinuations about me, someone needs to clear
it up. I come here to learn and talk about what I have learned.. Take
the wood boat thread for instance.. I have a lot to learn there, but
was pretty much unable to participate having to defend wafa's
continuous distortions. This is not productive, I gotta' go..
 >> Stay informed about: Good Morning Harry Krause 

On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 06:23:15 -0400, "Eisboch" <rce RemoveThis @nowhere.com> wrote:

>
>"Calif Bill" <bmckeespam RemoveThis @ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
>news:S66dnexfQf60wjPVnZ2dnUVZ_trinZ2d@earthlink.com...
>>
>> "Eisboch" <rce RemoveThis @nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> news:o9-dnY2ZHO2nxjDVnZ2dnUVZ_rjinZ2d@giganews.com...
>>>
>>> <thunder RemoveThis @TAKEOUTgti.net> wrote in message
>>> news:hJadnfMUoulgxDDVnZ2dnUVZ_vzinZ2d@posted.gtinet...
>>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 16:00:31 -0400, Eisboch wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> But, I read. I agree, years ago it was easy and "safe" to hire
>>>>> illegals. Laws with substantial penalties have been put in place to
>>>>> discourage that practice however and they are enforced.
>>>>>
>>>>> Eisboch
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps in your business, but in many sectors, construction for
>>>> instance,
>>>> there is a large "underground" economy. Not only are illegals hired,
>>>> but
>>>> many citizens are paid under the table. Estimates of illegal immigrants
>>>> are 10-15 million. They are coming here to make a living. Somebody is
>>>> hiring them.
>>>
>>>
>>> I realize that and have witnessed it. But, they are not typically
>>> "corporations". They are often small time construction or landscaper
>>> type businesses that simply don't show up on the radar screen.
>>
>> Corporations do hire them. They look at the required documentation and
>> hire them. The government may come back a year later and say the SS
>> number is bogus, but there is no way to run legal quick check on an
>> employee's documentation.
>
>I think the Duck correctly pointed out the error of my initial statement
>whereby I left out the word "knowingly".

Yes, but did you knowingly know it?
 >> Stay informed about: Good Morning Harry Krause 

"Short Wave Sportfishing" <email RemoveThis @swsportsremove.org> wrote in message
news:6s5ta4hkti487pu05p4cqoueaid1aklpim@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 06:23:15 -0400, "Eisboch" <rce RemoveThis @nowhere.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Calif Bill" <bmckeespam RemoveThis @ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
>>news:S66dnexfQf60wjPVnZ2dnUVZ_trinZ2d@earthlink.com...
>>>
>>> "Eisboch" <rce RemoveThis @nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>> news:o9-dnY2ZHO2nxjDVnZ2dnUVZ_rjinZ2d@giganews.com...
>>>>
>>>> <thunder RemoveThis @TAKEOUTgti.net> wrote in message
>>>> news:hJadnfMUoulgxDDVnZ2dnUVZ_vzinZ2d@posted.gtinet...
>>>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 16:00:31 -0400, Eisboch wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> But, I read. I agree, years ago it was easy and "safe" to hire
>>>>>> illegals. Laws with substantial penalties have been put in place to
>>>>>> discourage that practice however and they are enforced.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Eisboch
>>>>>
>>>>> Perhaps in your business, but in many sectors, construction for
>>>>> instance,
>>>>> there is a large "underground" economy. Not only are illegals hired,
>>>>> but
>>>>> many citizens are paid under the table. Estimates of illegal
>>>>> immigrants
>>>>> are 10-15 million. They are coming here to make a living. Somebody
>>>>> is
>>>>> hiring them.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I realize that and have witnessed it. But, they are not typically
>>>> "corporations". They are often small time construction or landscaper
>>>> type businesses that simply don't show up on the radar screen.
>>>
>>> Corporations do hire them. They look at the required documentation and
>>> hire them. The government may come back a year later and say the SS
>>> number is bogus, but there is no way to run legal quick check on an
>>> employee's documentation.
>>
>>I think the Duck correctly pointed out the error of my initial statement
>>whereby I left out the word "knowingly".
>
> Yes, but did you knowingly know it?

No. But now I know I knowingly didn't know it.

Eisboch
 >> Stay informed about: Good Morning Harry Krause 

On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 09:10:50 -0700 (PDT), justwaitafrekinminute RemoveThis @gmail.com
wrote:

>On Aug 22, 11:28 am, hk <payer33... RemoveThis @mypacks.net> wrote:
>> justwaitafrekinmin... RemoveThis @gmail.com wrote:

snipped
>>
>> > This kind of outright lie is why only you and Dick can talk about this
>> > stuff. To the rest of us, the conversation is useless ..
>>
>> What outright lie? I recall you stating the police had tossed you down
>> the stairs. I don't recall what problems you had with your "union shop,"
>> nor do I care. Everyone has had "problems" sometime in life. Most of us
>> get over them and move on.- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
>Nope, they shoved, I caught myself.. This is why nobody else can get
>into your conversations, you can't be honest about anything..

Why try?
 >> Stay informed about: Good Morning Harry Krause 

On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 10:12:34 -0700 (PDT), justwaitafrekinminute RemoveThis @gmail.com
wrote:

>On Aug 22, 12:45 pm, John H. <salmonremovebait@gmaildotcom> wrote:
>> On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 09:10:50 -0700 (PDT), justwaitafrekinmin... RemoveThis @gmail.com
>> wrote:
>>
>> >On Aug 22, 11:28 am, hk <payer33... RemoveThis @mypacks.net> wrote:
>> >> justwaitafrekinmin... RemoveThis @gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> snipped
>>
>>
>>
>> >> > This kind of outright lie is why only you and Dick can talk about this
>> >> > stuff. To the rest of us, the conversation is useless ..
>>
>> >> What outright lie? I recall you stating the police had tossed you down
>> >> the stairs. I don't recall what problems you had with your "union shop,"
>> >> nor do I care. Everyone has had "problems" sometime in life. Most of us
>> >> get over them and move on.- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> >> - Show quoted text -
>>
>> >Nope, they shoved, I caught myself.. This is why nobody else can get
>> >into your conversations, you can't be honest about anything..
>>
>> Why try?
>
>Because I represent my business here and when he makes up deliberate
>lies, distortions, and insinuations about me, someone needs to clear
>it up. I come here to learn and talk about what I have learned.. Take
>the wood boat thread for instance.. I have a lot to learn there, but
>was pretty much unable to participate having to defend wafa's
>continuous distortions. This is not productive, I gotta' go..

Scotty, the guy has no credibility. He is important to three people,
including Dick. No matter what he says about you, or your business, he's
not believed. Filter him and pay no attention to him!
 >> Stay informed about: Good Morning Harry Krause