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Canoe and kayak safety

 
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Frank Healy

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Since: Sep 29, 2003
Posts: 12



(Msg. 16) Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2003 12:05 am
Post subject: Re: Canoe and kayak safety [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: rec>boats>paddle (more info?)

"Mary Malmros" <malmros.DeleteThis@shore.net> wrote in message
news:gp77k3ri2nq.fsf@nautilus.shore.net

 > "Frank Healy" <frankandjames.DeleteThis@lepton.fsnet.co.uk> writes:
 >
  > > Really quite ammused at the idea of being paid.
 >
 > Dude, yer wealthy. Don't you know that? William Watt said so.


Wish someone would tell my bank manager! With regards Young Master Watt
young people often come out with idealistic nonsense - Really cannot
someone have a word with his mother - perhaps she should ground him
( Say under 6ft of it ) then he would not bother us grown ups. When I
was a lad my Grandmother used to say "Little boys should be seen and
not heard" Are you listening Mr Watt ?

Happy Paddling - Whichever style you do.

Frank Healy


--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.Mailgate.ORG" target="_blank">http://www.Mailgate.ORG</a><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->

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Scott Bemis

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Since: Oct 02, 2003
Posts: 12



(Msg. 17) Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2003 2:48 pm
Post subject: Re: Canoe and kayak safety, sponsons [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

I understand due to unusual advertising bouncing around the Internet
regarding sponsons, this is quite an emotional topic.
Before any advice

I have sponsons. I do not sell them. I can capsize my kayak with
sponsons attached. This takes more effort than without these devices.
As long as I do my eskimo roll correct, with the sponsons attached,
I can capsize and roll up consistently on my strong or left side (no
wind or waves). I can almost make the roll up on my weaker or right
side. I cannot stand up in the kayak with the sponsons, although with
practice I could. And with practice, I could stand up in the kayak
without sponsons.

The sponsons offer some measure of safety. For me, sponsons are a
great way to perfect my eskimo roll in a sea kayak. I have to do
everything correct to roll back up with my sea kayak with the sponsons
attached. I think good bracing technique and an eskimo roll are
better techniques.

To use a bicycle comparison, sponsons offer less safety than training
wheels on a bicycle. When much younger, I had great difficulty
tipping over a bicycle with training wheels (would have to be going
"fast" around a curve). I can roll a kayak with sponsons (see above).

I believe the safety is less than advertised. The sponsons (I bought
used) came with a serious product defect. There are plastic clips.
Upon my testing using eyepads on a kayak, one or both of these clips
came off the eyepad (in a real world situation, the sponson would had
blown away). I replaced the plastic clips with chain links. This
replacement solved the problem of the sponsons detaching from the
kayak. I was quite annoyed at this defect. The end of the inflation
tube (which connects to the sponson) also came off during "sea trials"
and the sponson deflated. A little epoxy fixed that problem.

I will still consider the use of sponsons as a last ditch safety
device (swamped canoe, in a storm). There is the good question of how
did I end up on the water in those conditions. The kayak or canoe is
somewhat more stable. I have not tested my boats with sponsons in two
to four foot waves while traveling parallel to the waves. This is
next on the list. I will also use the sponsons with a downwind sail
as they offer more stability with both the flatwater canoe and sea
kayak.

And yes, they are view with disdain by many and much hated on Internet
newsgroups - (like bicycling around with training wheels).

End

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Michael Daly

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Since: Jun 23, 2003
Posts: 48



(Msg. 18) Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2003 10:13 pm
Post subject: Re: Canoe and kayak safety, sponsons [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

On 2-Oct-2003, sebemis.TakeThisOut@self-serv.net (Scott Bemis) wrote:

 > I have sponsons. [...]
 > I believe the safety is less than advertised.[...]

Your experience is similar to mine (though mine are based
on brief experimentation with the product). I also agree
with your conclusions.

The biggest problem is not the product (all safety products
have advantages and disadvantages and require practice
to be used effectively) but the idiot that sells one brand.
He has done more to harm their reputation than anyone
who opposes them.

If someone reads your comments and buys the product with
knowledge of their advantages and drawbacks, at least they
will be fairly informed.

Mike<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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Oci-One Kanubi

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Since: Jun 26, 2003
Posts: 86



(Msg. 19) Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2003 11:09 am
Post subject: Re: Canoe and kayak safety, sponsons [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

sebemis RemoveThis @self-serv.net (Scott Bemis) typed:

 > I understand due to unusual advertising bouncing around the Internet
 > regarding sponsons, this is quite an emotional topic.
 >
 > [snip happens]
 >
 > And yes, they are view with disdain by many and much hated on Internet
 > newsgroups - (like bicycling around with training wheels).

Not really. I don't think anyone has argued that sponsons are not of
potential value when they are viewed as one element in a larger
toolkit of safety skills and devices.

It's not "sponsons", per se, that are hated, but the feller that
markets them by calling "murderers" everyone who teaches any other
safety skill, or the use of any other safety device, and who would
have the use of sponsons mandated by government for all boats
(including whitewater boats, which are completely outside of his
experience, and outside of the experiences you describe).

If he could have discussed his device rationally, and recognized that
it is not a universal panacea, he probably would have been welcomed as
a valuable and creative member of this newsgroup. But he is obscene
(in his unfeeling references to boaters who have drowned) and
obnoxious -- an inarticulate and irrational spammer -- and nobody
really wants him around.

-Richard, His Kanubic Travesty
--
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Richard Hopley, Winston-Salem, NC, USA
rhopley[at]earthlink[dot]net 1-301-775-0471
Nothing really matters except Boats, Sex, and Rock'n'Roll.
rhopley[at]wfubmc[dot]edu 1-336-713-5077
OK, OK; computer programming for scientific research also matters.
======================================================================<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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